Springtime Living In An Abandoned Ghost Town!

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I have worked for my local water department for 36 years. I literally just diagnosed a pressure issue for a resident. After a simple test, I realized he had a 6” long GALVANIZED nipple just before his water meter. Turns out the inside was so choked up with rust, you couldn’t see through it. When you pointed to the galvanized pipe which is WAY longer than 6”, I decided to comment.

I am a water well drilling & pump contractor here in Northern CA. 80% of the Wells I driller are over 700 feet deep, I would recommend using Grundfos 6SQF-3 pump it will run on any voltage AC or DC and it is one of the only submersible pumps that that will run horizontally also has a built-in low water shut off and very simple to install, you’ll need 1 inch minimum pipe I would recommend using sch. 120 PVC threaded pipe, you must have check valves every 200 feet of elevation and a minimum of #8 wire 2 strands with a ground as long as your run is not much more than 800 feet. This
Grundfos is a very reliable pump as long as the water is clean going into it. From what I could see in your video I would not do anything to your collection pool other than maybe trying to clean the area up to get cleaner water

Shoutout to everyone who's watched the entire journey...

It's been quite an experience getting to watch Brent go from Wide-Eyed city dweller who tried to tackle a mountain snow storrn in a FWD 4cyl truck...

...to experienced and storied desert dweller who's become the face of Death Valley surrounding area.

Can't wait to see what's next!

You should built an underground cistern like they use to in ancient desert towns. That would collect snow melt and you would be able to use it during the summer

At 700', you are fighting against ~304psi of static water pressure due to the weight of water in the pipe, not including friction when pumping. This is asking a lot of your pump which maxes out at 350psi. I think you really want a deep well submersible pump. Check the head ratings and give yourself some margin, don't choose a solution right on the edge of specs. You can probably find one that would do at least 800ft of head, but these get more expensive. I would do it in 2 stages. Pick a level half way up and install an intermediary tank, open to atmosphere, to relieve half the pressure. You can get a submersible from Home Depot that can do 427' of head for $200. I would have a large tank at/near the surface that you can keep topped off with well water or hauled in water as your main supply/reserve. You will likely need to upgrade your electrical supply to 240V to run the submersibles. You could try running that just to the intermediary level first so you don't have to run it as far, and see if your existing pump at the bottom could supply to the intermediary tank with a little tweaking. You can use float switches/relays to prevent either pump from drawing the levels too low, or filling the top tank too high. If supply power is a bottleneck, you could do some relay logic/controls to make sure only one pump is running at a time. I would recommend using a sediment filter, uv filter, and charcoal filter between your "well" water and the surface fresh water tank. Getting it tested for heavy metals is probably a good idea, but even then, you could probably do a small distiller system for drinking water if you find the levels are a bit elevated. Just some thoughts.

Doing a 2 stage tank “top-off” solution, you would want “high-level” and “low-level” float switches (or some form of water sensors) mounted in each “reservoir” for a total of 6 switches. I would make them somewhat adjustable. Then it's just logic…PLC, microcontroller, old-school relay logic, etc…whatever you prefer. You don't want to run either reservoir too low, and don't want your pump to suck air. You also don't want to overflow the intermediary stage or surface tank. So the bottom pump only runs if pit’s high-level switch is reached AND in-between tank high-level switch has NOT been reached. Once the in-between tank's high-level is reached OR the pits low-level is indicated, shut off first pump. Only when first pump is off and intermediary tank is at it’s high level, switch on upper pump and fill surface tank until it’s high-level is reached OR the in-between tank’s low-level limit triggers, then shut off second pump. If the surface tank high-level has not yet been reached, restart the cycle with the lower pump filling intermediary tank, etc., etc. until it eventually tops off. When top tank low-level is reached, then reset and start the process over starting from the bottom pump. There may be some nuances to sort out, a slightly different order of operations, or you might want a way to manually reset a state if two triggers happen to overlap unexpectedly, but this is the general idea. If you are concerned about a stuck float, you could double-up in a Fail-Safe manner for some cross-check redundancy. Maybe even add some timer logic to shut the system down if a pump is running longer than expected…that way you don't flood the place if there is a burst pipe or something. You will need at least 3 control wires from each level to get these indications, or you could send statuses back over some other COM path, like your Ethernet run.

Pumps are very bad at sucking water, but pumps can be very good at pushing water. A pump can only be 6-8 meters above the water source before the vacuum the pump needs to pull the water causes the water to 'boil'; and the pump vanes to cavitate. The solution is to look for a low flow, high head, SUBMERSIBLE pump, probably a reciprocating pump (more expensive unfortunately) and put it under the water. Since you have a nice big tank to hold the pumped water, the only purpose of the submersible pump should be to slowly and fairly constantly (as subterranean water levels allow) bring the water to the tank - it's job is not to deliver working pressure and high flow to taps/showers etc, you will need another pump for that.

Howdy, Brent. I used to be in the water treatment business years ago, and wells were part of that. The first thing I'd do, before I spent another dollar on that entire system, would be to test the water quality. If it's loaded with lead or other heavy metals, you don't want to be drinking it. If it's drinkable (or just usable), that 700 foot+ of head should not be a huge problem if you consider that a lot of wells go way deeper than than. It's already been mentioned below, but you need to get a legit submersible well pump. This is pretty much a "seep" type water source, so another consideration you need to look at before spending a ton of money on the system is to determine how much water you can get out of it before it needs to replenish, and the replenish time. The size of the collection pond is less of an issue (with a good pump), but lining it to make sure you aren't losing water to overflow or leakage would be a big help in determining how much water is actually available on an hourly or daily basis. If the water is good and you can pull enough out every day to make it worth the expense, then it's totally doable. It was mentioned below, but, yea, get rid of any of that old galvanized pipe out of your new system. Hope it helps, bro! Cheers!

Years ago, I serviced and sold commercial and industrial pumps and equipment. With the depth (head) you are dealing with at the bottom of the mine, you will need a multistage pump that is capable of pumping that distance. You are also dealing with pressure drop on the size of the pipe and every elbow in the line causes a loss in the pressure and flow potential. Increasing the size of the pipe and minimizing the elbows will increase the pressure and flow on your water pump system. You also need several check valves in your piping system to decrease the time your pump needs to run to get the water to the top of the mountain. If you lose the "prime" on your pump the motor needs to run until the water makes it all the way back up the pipe. Several check valves in the piping system will keep the pipe "primed" lowering the cost to run the pump each day. You should also have a pressure tank on your water system to minimize short cycling of the pump. A multistage submersible pump is readily available and a 1000' roll of black 1-1/4" or 1-1/2" polyethylene pipe will be a cost-effective choice for the system. You could use a level switch on your large water tank to control when the pump runs, you will also need a level switch in your sump at the bottom of the mine, so you do not run the pump dry and burn the motor up. Knowing how much water your sump can provide on an hourly or daily basis will help determine what size of pump you need.

I can't believe I have been watching for 4 years! Time is so weird. It still feels like a somewhat new channel to me.

Hey Brent! I'm a rancher not a wells and pumps expert, but the brand and model of pump you have there is not a well pump, it's a fertilizer pump - it likely will not deliver water at 700' of head.
You might look into a 3-5 horse well pump that will deliver the flow rate you seek at that tall head, along with a pressure tank to relieve the pump so that it doesn't have to cycle repeatedly for small draws. Rapid cycling is tough on electric motors.
Next question is supply - how big is that puddle you are drawing from and what is the refill rate?
So, if you get a big enough pump that is designed for the job, right at the water source, a pressure system, and providing your reservoir is resilient enough to supply the amount you need, you should be in business.
We had a similar issue with a deep well in the mountains, too much demand would suck the pocket reservoir dry and fill the system with sediment. Agh.

I’m sure someone has brought this up, but for every foot of elevation from the source, you add .433 psi. If you are 700 feet down, that could be up 303 psi to push. It may not translate exactly but when we install fire pumps into high rise (domestic water is the same) we are generally using pressurized public water supplies and still have compensate quite a lot to reach 200 feet.

Unfortunately, your 1/3 hp pump at the gpm it’s rated won’t ever meet your needs.

Talk to the guys doing the fire sprinkler system at the hotel, they should have the hydraulic calculation software to help size your pump and line. Probably a break tank and pumps at several levels.

Starting at your sump, Pump up to a 200 gallon tank at an intermediate level and stage another pump to another intermediate pump, etc. (based on calcs) then to your large tank and let it fill over days.

Your pumps will be set with a float on each to shut off when it gets low and back on at a good level.

That way each smaller and more affordable sized pumps will be pushing reasonable amounts.

Have you calculated the natural refill time of the sump?

In a world full of negativity and social media madness, each post you make is a mental cleanser to me.

Thank you so much my friend. We'll see your dreams come true and be with you vicariously.

Brent, I've worked on pumps and pump systems for 30 years. This is a somewhat long read. I would say forget conventional centrifugal water pumps and go with a small belt driven plunger pump. It is a positive displacement type pump and when set up correctly will push the water to the surface with few issues, and it doesn't have to be a monster to get the job done.

Something along the lines of a 3" stroke with 1.25" plungers running at 200 rpm would move about 9 gallons per minute/310 BPD. To lift 700ft would require about 7.5 HP. {220V} Pulsation is a consideration, go with a triplex { three plungers} because simplex and duplex pumps will beat the piping to death. A triplex will still have pulsation but much less pronounced.

You will need a small centrifugal charge pump in the pit to feed it. A plunger pump does not like to lift water on the suction side, lack of head pressure on the suction will cause it to run rough. 5 psi on the suction is plenty. Both pumps can be started automatically with a simple float switch.

There are other considerations in such a system but this is the basic setup. Call a local pump company and talk to them. A good used plunger pump of this size is fairly cheap, reliable and easy to repair.

One suggestion for your vegetable garden. Cover the soil with mulch. It would add nutrients, lower the soil temperature and decrease the speed of evaporation. Plants develop more slowly if the soil is too hot. Best wishes, you're awesome.

I just realized something. The comments are from people who want to help or congratulate you all. Very different from so many media comment platforms. Keep up Cerro Gordo snd commentators keep up the encouraging comments.

As someone who designs industrial pumping systems, 20-5000 psi @ 1/4-400 gpm. First thing I would do is increase the diameter of the suction hose (3/4 to 1 inch minimum) and level it off as much as possible.

People forget about a thing called fluidic friction when sucking water. Imagine a cross section of the suction pipe as a stack of telescoping tubes, with the outermost one secured and immobile. As you pull the inner most layer, each layer drags against it's neighboring layer. Because each layer is moving increasingly faster as you near the center, the larger the tube the less energy it takes to move the fluid. Pumps have the hardest time overcoming suction issues than discharge issues

Changes in elevation means the pump has to lift the water more which is dificult on the suction side, so the closer the pump inlet can get to the elevation of the water surface the better.

As far as pumps go I would suggest a 3 cylinder piston or plunger pump, similar to what is used on pro-sumer or professional grade pressure washer. 700 foot colum of water produces approximately 300 psi of pressure, so you want a pump that runs at 350-400 psi, but is designed to run at 700-1000 psi for longevity. Where I work we've had great luck with Cat Pumps (not caterpillar). Cat Pumps sells pumps and prebuilt pumping skids, so you just tell their local rep the flow rate, pressure you want and what power available and they can set you up. Because of conditions in the mine, Im not sure if a Brass or Stainless head would be better. If you test a pro-sumer or consumer grade pressure washer, you will need to get a rebuild kit as they usually remove one of the inlet springs so it self drains when shut off. This protects it from an owner not draining the pump in the winter, which also means it wont generate enough vacuum to efficiently suck up the water.

I would worry about the PEX tubning, I'm not sure if you used or if there is an extra strength version, but regular PEX is only rated at 160 psi @ 70F (normal operating pressure), and has a burst rating of 475-500 psi. At the pump head you have a 300 psi column of water (based on the weight of 700 feet of water) before the pump starts running....

Take care and keep safe

You need to start calling it a "living" mining town, you've brought life back to it mate

Get Heavy D out and channel the sides of the road and build several ponds that pool water. The amount of snow/rain coming off your mountains would provide enough water to last the year. Plus it would stop washouts ruining your winters.

Good luck Brent!!!

In a world where negativity and social media chaos abound, I find solace in each post you make. Much obliged, my friend. We'll be there for you virtually and see your dreams come true.