Why I don't like other gamedev YouTubers

Have you been living under a rock? There is a lot of YT game dev who share their real numbers, I think the indie game dev community is very open and transparent in general. There are tons of data about people sharing their experiences and numbers.

Devlogs don't convert to wishlists because their audience isn't gamers, it's aspiring developers.

This is 100% me. I'm spending too much time on YouTube. Thank you for making this video.

I mainly watch them to keep myself motivated. Seeing others reach for goals similar to mine makes me feel less alone in my own process

I totally agree with a number of YouTubers being fake and making outlandish claims that you can get $100K in funding if you just buy their book or course and they'll be an expert in weeks. There are no shortcuts in life. Determine what you really want to do and put in the work.

I think the problem with making devlogs is that a lot of the viewers are mainly watching to learn how they made the game, and not because they're actually interested in playing the game. The audience for these types of videos are game developers. Not people who want to play games.

I like how you approach "failure".

You guys can be... brutally transparent / introspective.

You also don't spin it -- if something failed... or something did not work... you guys just accept it as a genuine lesson (which you emphasise can bloody hurt) but you don't try to spin it any further.

Failure hurts, and that progress from failure is ultimately all that can we can do -- not about spinning it into some "positive" all the time.

You guys are actually truly about reality of game "development", not game "success" (per se).

To be fair to the guy and his magnet game, he's in the home stretch now. He came to the realisation not too long ago that "how long have I been working on this, again?", and devised a roadmap for himself. If I recall correctly he is lacking the music part and is going to outsource it because he has no experience in this field, but is pretty much set aside from that.

Your point about art and having a "pretty" finish before anything else is also valid. I give my 2 cents every now and then being an artist mysself, but from a devlog perspective it make no sense to go through art first. Unless you have a precise vision for it, art should complement gameplay, and not the other way around. It's less sexy in a presentation, but it makes for less ressources wasted.

Finally, I remember hearing somewhere that we tend to mistake the taking of information as aquiring experience. Our brain is biased in this way and it triggers when you download a picture or watch a video, so it could explain why people "waste" so much time on youtube.

(though I read that a while ago and cannot recall where, so take it with a grain of salt as it could be wrong).

I hope you don't catch too much hate for this one, as it sounds quite like a rant at first glance. Your points are good, but I fear a few people are gonna hear "watch our videos, not the other guy's".

the reason they start with the art, is so they can start promoting the game as early as possible in order to get to the point that they get enough wishlists by the time they're ready to launch. The idea is to have a trailer, steam and website up and running as early as possible in the game development's process.

It's a breath of fresh air listening to someone who understands that making devlogs attracts mostly gamedevs 👍

Let me preface this by saying that I honestly think you have one of the most transparent game dev channels. I do love that you’re not just trying to sell on the highs but focus on the lows for a balanced breakfast. Pretty sure this is my favorite game dev channel. That said, you have legit mastered the art of the subtle plug.

So many plugs: forge industries, the coaching call option, bite me videos routing, songs of ever-jade, your discord.

You’re an amazing salesman. Definitely my favorite game dev channel.

Totally agree, that's a sentiment I share. That feeling of "this is not gamedev, it's just youtube".
And after 2 years of making youtube (but a lot more doing gamedev), it's something that is getting obvious, you gotta choose between youtube and gamedev.
Mid October, I started working on a 3rd devlog of my game, then I released it and the next day I started a gamejam, 2 weeks later I had the results of the jam, so I started to work on a devlog and I'm almost done editing and the video should be out this week, but then my most successful video is last year's yearly recap, so I'll make a yearly recap this year too !

This means I'll spend 2-3 months without progress on my game. It just doesn't work.
I like gamedev youtube, I like to watch it, I have fun trying to be part of it, but viewers have to understand that it's video entertainment, it's not what gamedev is.

I'm working on my game/games daily (around 8 hours per day) and when I'm done or during my break I watch your videos cause I deeply respect your approach. Yes, your YouTube persona and engagement will help your studio in the long run, but you decide to be honest and give us your truth without the whole "shortcut" crap we see all around us! All the best and keep them coming guys!

I agree with your point on editing out the realistic struggles of development being potentially harmful, but I think it's unfair to drag Crimson Hollow into the conversation. I can't speak for the other devlogs I haven't seen like Night Stones. She doesn't claim to pull of coding magic, just sharing her passion project. Maybe I'm getting defensive over a series I like watching, but this video is approaching "look how good we are, those guys don't deserve the views" territory. Just my take. Keep up the transparency and realistic dev content.

This is really eye-opening, something you consider in the back of your mind, something you slowly realize, then have someone come out and confirm it.

I love finding channels like this that keep things grounded. Miziziziz is another good example. He doesn't post often, but he's an experienced dev who does actually put games out, gives good advice, and doesn't sugarcoat anything. He also has a great sense of cynical humour.

I also think it's no coincidence that he also gives similar advice to new devs: "don't expect big numbers from your first game. Make it small, and release it. Make bigger games later."

It's a path I'm trying to follow myself. After a few "small, but still not small enough" non-starters, I've just started another, even-less-ambitious project: a side-scrolling shooter. Super simple, but I'm having a blast with it because it's so straightforward.

This is a fantastic reality check imo, it's the same issue that plagues social media and people's images of themselves. Nobody ever really posts their day to day hardships and struggles so it's easy to think "oh this very popular and pretty person has no problems and is successful, where did i go wrong??". The thing is is that everyone struggles and everyone makes mistakes and that's incredibly important to keep in mind. Great video!

Hmm, not sure which game devs you're referring to but I think I watch quite a few who are genuine. Just because they might concentrate on visuals first for the sake of YT engagement and watch time (or even for marketing purposes as several game devs have shown this to be effective even if it is a bit backwards of an approach), doesn't mean that they aren't genuine. Especially if their initial background was in art first over other aspects of game development. In terms of really long projects, that's really their prerogative. For some it's a passion project, or a side hobby, or an all stakes gamble. And whatever reasoning for the length of the project or how they approach it in game dev is their own personal journey. At least that's how I perceive it. I guess some people probably do watch those videos and think that's what they should aspire to be.

In regards to showcasing difficulty hurdles in the game development process...I mean, do you expect someone to spend the whole video talking about how this bug halted their progress for days or something? I don't think this would be too entertaining to watch/listen to and I think the fact that they mention it at all is enough to show that they aren't trying to hide the truth or something. And as what someone else already mentioned, I think plenty of developers (at least in the indie scene) tend to be very transparent with numbers. Honestly, it's because of people like them (and you're own channel, of course) that people aspiring to make a commercial game can get a bit more of a realistic expectation.

Personally, I watch game dev videos (although I mainly listen to them while I'm doing other things) to keep me motivated and inspired to continue on with my own journey. I also don't mind commenting on the videos at times too (especially the smaller channels) because I think every comment helps a bit with the motivation. Or at least I know it does for me.

I agree with what you said here, though showing some other YouTubers footage while you are talking about an issue, implies that youtuber is complicit in that issue.
For example, a few seconds after making the fair point that some other devs haven't even released a game yet, you showed Challacades awesome Legend of Luna, who is a dev who has completed and published 2 or 3 games already.

I'm at my dayjob. I watch game dev videos at my day job and almost never outside of that. So keep in mind there are likely plenty of others like me who aren't wasting time at all, but instead using YouTube to learn passively when they can't learn actively at that moment.
I watch these kinds of videos and devlogs because it continually feeds me ideas about game dev, when I physically can't DO game dev.

That said, I think you're also looking at devlogs the wrong way. You're looking at it in a pessimistic light. I don't. When I see someone talk about about the issues they had and how they got over them, it gives me hope. It says to me that other devs find there way through or sometimes around problems, and so can I. This gives me motivation to want to clock out of my dayjob and get to work on my game.
This is especially important because I don't consider myself a programmer, or what you call developer. I'm an artist first and I'm stumbling my way through programming my game. Maybe it's the difference between the mindsets: artist vs programmer. Not sure.

I'm wondering if maybe you should be teaching devs how to look at these videos in the right way. Do it passively when you physically can't dev. And view it as hopeful and motivational. To drive them to get through the next issue. Because that's what they teach me. There's always a solution, and whether or not it's a good or bad solution, you will get through it.

Anyway, that's my piece. Love you guys!