Stun, but Actually Interesting

Its why i like sf6's take on stun, instead of getting your ass beat as a punishment for... getting your ass beat, you get your ass beat as a punishment for overusing your resources and getting pinned down in the corner/not stopping the DI

Ed Boon disliked stuns in Street Fighter II so much he moved them to the end of the round in Mortal Kombat.

Stun is an intresting and deep mechanic when i stun them and a shit mechanic that honestly should just be removed when i get stunned

I assumed this would’ve been called: “STUN…but FUN”

Honestly I don't know why it took so long for games to actually display how close you are to stun

You forgot to mention the best thing about stun in Karnov's Revenge: the sound effect it makes.

Haha, I'm in some of this Karnov's footage.

I really like Xrd's take on Stun. Getting stunned by being repeatedly counter hit, the bigger the counter hit the more stun damage you take, really feeds into the games "big risks, big rewards" style of gameplay.

Smash only has stun if you get your shield broken, which is an interesting method of handling it. Punishing you for trying to turtle. Other platform fighters put you in temporary stun if you get your move parried, allowing for an easier/stronger followup.

Honestly, the concept of you being in control of what hurt animation (stance) you're in while being combo'd in Karnov's Revenge is honestly more interesting to me than the overall conversation on stun mechanics itself. It's like ... like Smash DI before Smash was a thing. Incredibly interesting. Thanks for showing this, I learned something new today

Soul caliber air control is another “getting hit mini game”. It’s not always well used, but there are some really interesting situations it can create. Especially with walls and ring out. Knowing your opponent won’t air control like they normally would because of a ring out and going for a much more damaging but normally avoided combo route is very hype

I have NEVER understood stuns. Ever since SF2 decided to have different sprites for the stuns (reapers, angels, stars), I've been confused about it. It is 100% a win-more mechanic.

theory fighter starts playing 3S "So lets talk about stun"

I do see the point of stun in SF2. With it being both a bait and an incentive for both parties to either play more risky or more defensively. In this game you don't get stun only after eating 2 jump-in combos but you can get stun even after eating 2 fireballs so it really makes you consider backing off if you just ate 2 pokes in a row. Also the combos are very fast and short (and you also die in a second) compared to modern games, so it isn't like SF4 or 5 in where a stun combo just leads to the other player gathering dust for 10 seconds as their character gets destroyed. Great example for an interesting stun combo also, I can see Karnov's take being pretty damn good for a more polished fighting game. Something with mechs maybe like Cyberbots in which some parts might be breakable or hitting them many times in a row causes the mech to malfunction.

Excellent video! There is so much hidden depth to Karnov's Revenge that so many people overlook, and I think it's great to have a video like this that shows just how interesting and complex the game can actually be. On a side note, a romhack is being developed (Karnov's Revenge Revolution) that rebalances the game, adds new moves and supers, and also changes the stun system a bit by making them match based as opposed to round based. I highly recommend anyone interested in Karnov's to check out .

What a stunning video

I knew about the weakpoint system in Karnov but this is my first time ever hearing about stance shift. Kind of a shame Karnov is mostly only recognized as a broken game because the more I learn about it, the more creative and nuanced I see it is. While it's not as interesting as Karnov's take on stun, I do like when games give you the option to prioritize stun at the cost of damage. Like the Ryu Denjin example you gave but I also liked the way Potemkin's Giganter worked in old GG games. Stun stops being a win-more in those situations and becomes the player making a choice to forgo upfront damage for more stun to create unique set-ups and combos.

8:14 This is one of the reasons I like smash more than most traditional fighters. It gives you something you can do while being attacked

Providing more engagement when getting hit/put in a combo is an approach that more games could benefit from, not just for stun. Nothing turns a new player off faster than getting hit with combos and having no input until the end. And depending on the game, that combo could be for a significant length of time.

Fantastic analysis. I'm making my own little fighting game, and I've yet to implement stun, so this has given me a LOT to think about! Thank you.